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Post by paulhannah on Apr 11, 2021 22:51:45 GMT
Converting the DBMM Army Lists for use with DBA 3.0... b) Divide all other DBMM amounts by 8, rounding down. Like Robert, I also just purchased a copy of (just) the Book-II DBMM lists. So, based on Stevie's sage guidance, I could make a case for six (count 'em, SIX!) "Peasant Rebel", Solid Hordes for a Han Chinese army. Woo hoo! Makes sense...basically, a Red Eyebrows or Yellow Turbans revolt army. |
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Post by snowcat on Apr 12, 2021 0:22:39 GMT
Converting the DBMM Army Lists for use with DBA 3.0... b) Divide all other DBMM amounts by 8, rounding down. Like Robert, I also just purchased a copy of (just) the Book-II DBMM lists. So, based on Stevie's sage guidance, I could make a case for six (count 'em, SIX!) "Peasant Rebel", Solid Hordes for a Han Chinese army. Woo hoo! Makes sense...basically, a Red Eyebrows or Yellow Turbans revolt army. Trust you!  |
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Post by stevie on Apr 12, 2021 8:45:19 GMT
Hmmm...not really that much different Paul. In DBA 3.0 the II/41a Western Han Chinese can already have 4 x 5Hd and 1 x 7Hd. Still, what’s an extra Horde amongst friends?  If you really have a fetish for Hordes, DBMM II/45 Slave Revolts allows 96 of ‘em, which divided by 8 becomes 12 x Hd in DBA... ...ah, but they must also have some other element types as well (either Ps/Ax/Cv/4Bd, plus the general’s element), so the maximum in DBA is about 7 x Hd. And as the loss of Hordes doesn’t count in DBA...talk about fight to the last man! |
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Post by timurilank on Apr 12, 2021 18:30:45 GMT
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dmg
Munifex
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Post by dmg on Apr 16, 2021 8:38:14 GMT
I've just been reading through this discussion, and while much of it doesnt apply to armies I have played with, it did highlight a detail in the DBA3 rules I'd missed.
“An element not in frontal close combat but in mutual right-to-right or left-to-left front corner contact with any enemy
element, except Psiloi, Scythed Chariots... "
I read this as psiloi and SC do not overlap enemy elements, but that they themselves can be overlapped..?
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Post by snowcat on Apr 16, 2021 9:00:28 GMT
I've just been reading through this discussion, and while much of it doesnt apply to armies I have played with, it did highlight a detail in the DBA3 rules I'd missed. “An element not in frontal close combat but in mutual right-to-right or left-to-left front corner contact with any enemy element, except Psiloi, Scythed Chariots... " I read this as psiloi and SC do not overlap enemy elements, but that they themselves can be overlapped..? Other way around; it's the Ps and SCh that can't be overlapped. |
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Post by stevie on Apr 16, 2021 9:17:01 GMT
Snowcat has already beaten me to it...yes, it’s actually the complete opposite. See Figure 16c on page 25 for an example. DBA 3.0 has a lot of ‘exceptions’, where a rule is described followed by an exception to that rule. I like to add brackets to my copy to make these exceptions stand out and be more memorable. So, “An element not in frontal close combat but in mutual right-to-right or left-to-left front corner contact with any enemy element ( except Psiloi or Scythed Chariots) overlaps this;”. Some of us think it would be a good idea if LH and Kn wedges also had this special advantage. See if the following helps to highlight and aid in the remembering of certain element abilities:- static.wikia.nocookie.net/fanaticus-dba/images/8/8e/Hint_Cards_for_DBA_3.0.pdf/revision/latest?cb=20190210013111
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Post by menacussecundus on Apr 16, 2021 9:31:33 GMT
I've just been reading through this discussion, and while much of it doesnt apply to armies I have played with, it did highlight a detail in the DBA3 rules I'd missed. “An element not in frontal close combat but in mutual right-to-right or left-to-left front corner contact with any enemy element, except Psiloi, Scythed Chariots... " I read this as psiloi and SC do not overlap enemy elements, but that they themselves can be overlapped..? Other way around; it's the Ps and SCh that can't be overlapped. They can't be overlapped if contact is only front corner to front corner as described. But they are overlapped if the contact is side edge to side edge. |
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dmg
Munifex
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Post by dmg on Apr 16, 2021 10:09:12 GMT
Thanks guys.
I'm not disputing your experience or wisdom, but having re-read the text a few times I still find it a tad ambiguous with regards to the overlapping or overlapped elements. It's a bit like one of those optical illusions where it's either a hare or a duck depending on which way you see it at the time. LOL.
I suppose if Phil had meant what I thought he meant, he'd have written, 'An element (except Psiloi or Scythed Chariots) not in frontal close combat but in mutual... etc'
Anyway, the diagram 16c clarifies it perfectly.
I don't have much game or historical knowledge of knights' combat tactics so I can't comment on those, but I see that Light Horse are treated essentially as mounted skirmishers, so I'd be happy for them to have the same overlap exclusion.
Cheers.
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Post by timurilank on Apr 18, 2021 12:36:55 GMT
Converting the DBMM Army Lists for use with DBA 3.0I have found that the following scaling-down method works quite well, if you first group all the troop types together to find their maximums. For example, work out the maximum number of DBMM Artillery, the maximum number of DBMM Psiloi, the maximum number of DBMM Auxiliaries, and so on, then:- a) If DBMM says “0-1”, then you can’t have that element. (as there are too few to be represented in a 12 element army) b) Divide all other DBMM amounts by 8, rounding down. (but any amount divided to be less than 1 is counted as 1) This roughly appears to be the method used to create the DBA lists, as you can see by looking at the DBMM II/12 Alexandrian Army. Good topic. But, let’s keep this seperate from the Cavalry wedge thread as I wish to continue adding information to it. The topic, converting the ‘DBMM Army list for DBA3 use is something I certainly would contribute to. |
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Post by stevie on Apr 18, 2021 17:36:39 GMT
Will do matey (I'm notorious for going off-topic  ) I’ll bung it in the House Rule section instead.. |
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