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Post by Baldie on Oct 11, 2023 15:57:15 GMT
Just watched Jeff's Alex vs Porus 3rd battle, seems Alex is invincible
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Post by paulisper on Oct 11, 2023 16:24:45 GMT
How problematic was the automatic pursuit in your games? I find the short line coupled with the inability to maintain even that is a fatal double-whammy! Jim The automatic pursuit just feels like a punishment more than anything. This is something we’re addressing in DBF… P
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Post by skb777 on Oct 11, 2023 16:41:36 GMT
Just watched Jeff's Alex vs Porus 3rd battle, seems Alex is invincible He is when you play against yourself
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Post by snowcat on Oct 11, 2023 23:20:48 GMT
I think the answer for Pk armies is, as others have proposed before, for them to be treated as double elements like 8Sp-------but with some kind of corresponding adjustment to their CFs.
Then, the first double element lost counting as 2 elements for victory conditions will be enough to balance out the big boost granted by the extended pike line.
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Post by snowcat on Oct 11, 2023 23:32:31 GMT
The automatic pursuit just feels like a punishment more than anything. This is something we’re addressing in DBF… P Great. Auto-pursuit feels right for hard charging knights, less so for solid Pk and Bd, etc...(or at least the negative effects of it upon the latter).
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Post by mwise on Oct 12, 2023 5:29:20 GMT
This is something we’re addressing in DBF… P Great. Auto-pursuit feels right for hard charging knights, less so for solid Pk and Bd, etc...(or at least the negative effects of it upon the latter). This was once called 'to become impetuous' which could happen to any troops with the right dice roll.
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Post by stevie on Oct 12, 2023 7:55:21 GMT
Great. Auto-pursuit feels right for hard charging knights, less so for solid Pk and Bd, etc...(or at least the negative effects of it upon the latter). This was once called 'to become impetuous' which could happen to any troops with the right dice roll. Ha!…see fanaticus.boards.net/post/10089/
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Post by paddy649 on Oct 12, 2023 8:03:52 GMT
Trouble is that in DBA1 (where all this started) Spear got +4 with +1 rear support, and Pike got +3 and +3. So Pike were at 6 vs 4 with risk of overlap or 6 vs 5 on the same frontage. In DBA3 Spear get side support so it’s 6 vs 5 with reduced frontage. So under the later rules Alex’s Pike are effectively nerfed when compared to the Greek Hoplites.
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Post by Baldie on Oct 12, 2023 9:27:37 GMT
Just waiting for DBF to be released then Ancient British warband/Orc & Goblin type armies can take their rightful place at the top of the pile.
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Post by skb777 on Oct 12, 2023 9:32:04 GMT
I think the answer for Pk armies is, as others have proposed before, for them to be treated as double elements like 8Sp------- but with some kind of corresponding adjustment to their CFs. Then, the first double element lost counting as 2 elements for victory conditions will be enough to balance out the big boost granted by the extended pike line. 6 elements of double based pike, glorious.
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Post by snowcat on Oct 12, 2023 10:26:49 GMT
Yes, they just need to be cleverly tweaked somehow...
(?)
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Post by skb777 on Oct 12, 2023 10:51:07 GMT
Well I'd still say CF +6 when 2 deep and CF +4 when side to side 9they didn't always fight 16 ranks deep dont'ya know) Sp get it so why not pike (crikey even Bd and Bw's get it)
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Post by snowcat on Oct 12, 2023 10:59:36 GMT
The problem exists because of the option to fight in depth as 2 out of the 12 elements, rather than 1 (double element) out of 12 elements. The frontage problem will remain unless this changes to a double element system for Pk. Then it is only the CF/outcomes that need tweaking.
(You can't have your cake and eat it.)
However, if you really want to keep the option for Pk to deploy thinner - which leaves you with reduced frontage when they don't - then Pk need to be improved vs Sp, and possibly a few other things.
A few years ago I proposed the idea that side-support for Sp *SHOULD NOT* count vs Pk because you're literally lining up nice and tight in their impalement zone, just how they like it. It's not how the Romans fought them. This would help.
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Post by skb777 on Oct 12, 2023 11:44:05 GMT
‘You can't have your cake and eat it’
Why can’t I? It’s only a CF of 4, still less that Sp (with support) and Bd.
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Post by snowcat on Oct 12, 2023 11:53:25 GMT
The point being that when the Pk deploy in depth (because 2 elements, not 1) - as they would by choice, more often than not, no? - they get nerfed by Sp. That's the bit that's broken. Creating ways for Pk to fight 'thin' vs Sp just to get back 'on par' with them in DBA is arse-about IMO.
Anyway, I've said enough about this here.
Back to the Battle Reports...!
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