True Auxilia

Hey Dpd.

Your thinking is on target. Version 3 has done this in many cases. I have noticed this most in the Greek Hoplite era lists. Much of the Ax has been reclassified as Ps. This of course has left me with too many Ax for those armies!

3Ax has been reserved for Hill Tribe warriors in loose formation.
4Ax is now for Thureophoroi, Hannibal's infantry, Roman Ax, and other Tribal infantry that doesn't warrant Wb status... (ie. Irish Nobility, Spanish, and others).

Joe Collins

Joe -

So yes, we get rid of 3SP by making them 4AX, and get rid of 3AX by making them 2PS.

Joe -

Not sure of the others, but the Irish Kern (3AX) are described in Wikipedia ("Gaelic Warfare") as:

Irish warfare was for centuries centered on the Ceithearn, or Kern in English (and so pronounced in Gaelic), light skirmishing infantry who harried the enemy with missiles before charging. John Dymmok, serving under Elizabeth I's lord-lieutenant of Ireland, described the kerns as: "A kind of footman, slightly armed with a sword, a target (round shield) of wood, or a bow and sheaf of arrows with barbed heads, or else three darts, which they cast with a wonderful facility and nearness." ... Because Kern were equipped and trained as light skirmishers, they faced a severe disadvantage in pitched battle.

DBA treats the Rising Out as 2PS and the Kern as 3AX. But the Rising Out was more a recruitment process than a distinct troop category.

In Summary, by moving 3AX into the "skirmisher" category along with 2PS, their relationship to 2PS is similar to that of 4BW to 3BW, 4LB to 3LB, 4CB to 3CB, or 4PK to 3PK.

Mixing the javelin armed 3AX with the mostly sling armed 2PS is really no different than combining javelin armed horsemen (Irish hobelars, Numidian horse, Spanish jinetes) with horse archers (Parthians, Mongols, Tartars) into the category of 2LH.

True Auxilia (like their imperial Roman namesakes) are armed with thrusting spears (like the hasta used by Roman Auxilia) NOT throwing spears.

Brian - then make the Kern into 4AX

I don’t know why you think that Roman Auxilia were only armed with thrusting spears, and had no javelins.
Phil Barker’s own “Armies and Enemies of Imperial Rome”, with multiple illustrations, shows this was not the case.
(Another essential book for ancient wargamers is “Armies of the Macedonian and Punic Wars” by Duncan Head)

But let’s see what ancient historian Tacitus tells us about the Battle of Mons Graupius in 84 AD:-

      “While Agricola was yet speaking, the ardour of the soldiers was rising to its height, and the
       close of his speech was followed by a great outburst of enthusiasm. In a moment they flew to arms.
       He arrayed his eager and impetuous troops in such a manner that the auxiliary infantry, 8,000 in number,
       strengthened his centre, while 3,000 cavalry were posted on his wings. The legions were drawn up in front
       of the entrenched camp; his victory would be vastly more glorious if won without the loss of Roman blood,
       and he would have a reserve in case of repulse.”
       (Source: www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.02.0081%3Achapter%3D35 )

So the Romans had their 8,000 Auxiliaries out in front, 3,000 Cavalry on the wings, and the Legions in reserve.
He goes on to say:-

      “The action began with distant fighting. The Britons with equal steadiness and skill used their huge swords
       and small shields to avoid or to parry the missiles of our soldiers, while they themselves poured on us a
       dense shower of darts, till Agricola encouraged three Batavian and two Tungrian cohorts to bring matters
       to the decision of close fighting with swords.”
       (Source: www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.02.0081%3Achapter%3D36 )

So there you have it…the Roman Auxiliaries lobbing masses of javelins at the ancient British Caledonians, who did the same.

Trying to categorize the DBA troop classes is one thing, and I fully support this…
…but it must also match the historical facts as well.

We should be making DBA fit history…not bending history to fit our own 21st century ideas and beliefs.

If don’t already have a copy of Duncan Head’s “Armies of the Macedonian and Punic Wars”, here is a snippet:-
    books.google.co.uk/books?redir_esc=y&id=jRpVwQEACAAJ&focus=searchwithinvolume&q=Peltast
    books.google.co.uk/books?redir_esc=y&id=jRpVwQEACAAJ&focus=searchwithinvolume&q=thureophorai
And here is a snippet from Phil Barker’s “Armies and Enemies of Imperial Rome”, mentioning the light ‘Lancea’:-
    books.google.co.uk/books?id=W3upCQAAQBAJ&q=auxiliary+infantryman#v=snippet&q=lancea&f=false

I wonder if the names that DBA uses merely confuses and muddies things.

Here is my take on the situation.
Ancient foot troops came in three main types:-
         * Light missile armed skirmishers (what DBA calls ‘Psiloi’…although I doubt that any Dark Age or Medieval
            general ever called them by the Greek word ‘Psiloi’, apart from the Greek speaking Byzantines of course).
            These avoided close combat, and often ‘evaded’ and fell back when charged in order to keep their distance.
         * Heavy infantry (Spears, Pikes, Blades and Warbands), that could only fight in hand-to-hand combat.
         * and Medium infantry (what DBA calls Aux), that could do both, depending upon the situation, and fought
            in a more open looser formation, making then faster and good in hindering terrain.
(There is a fourth type, bowmen, who like skirmishers wanted to keep their distance and avoid hand-to-hand fights)

The basic untrained undrilled irregular warrior is what DBA calls 3Ax. These fought in their natural undisciplined
disordered formation, sometimes with short spears, sometimes with javelins and swords. Examples of the latter
are Ancient Spanish, Thracians, Oscan Italians, Illyrians, and many others.
Gives these a bit of training and discipline and they become regulars (what DBA calls 4Ax). Examples are Hellenistic
Thureophoroi (with javelins and long spears), and Samnites plus Imperial Roman Auxilia (with javelins and swords).

“Troops are defined by battlefield behaviour instead of the usual formation, armour, weapons and morale”.
So call ‘em what you like; Aux, fast Spears or just medium infantry, their role and performance will be the same.