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Post by brasidas19004 on Aug 23, 2022 3:44:25 GMT
First, good to visit Fanaticus, the forum at which a long long time ago, I learned a lot about the brilliant math behind DBA.
Cracking a copy of 3.0, and I am a bit wowed and thrown off by a piece of the PIP Diceing rule: "In each bound, the first move of each single element or column uses 0 PIPs if it is - entirely by road - moved until it contacts enemy or friends - or moves its full tactical move distance, and does not reverse direction."
So, if I am reading this correctly, I can move all 12 elements one move for free, as long as I move according to one of the above three parameters, including a move into contact with enemy. So basically, if I'm within one tactical move of an enemy, I get a free move to contact. I guess it represents local initiative?
This is a bit mind-blowing, as one of the challenges of the game was managing the close fight, and deciding how to engage as your line broke up.
Or am I reading this incorrectly?
Aside from this, 3.0 makes a lot of sense to me, and I can see the way they addressed some issues.
Thanks for your thoughts!
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Post by stevie on Aug 23, 2022 6:00:05 GMT
Welcome to Fanaticus. And yes, the page 8 “Player Initiate Point Dicing” section could have been written a bit more clearly. Lets see if I can re-word it to make it clearer (the items in square brackets refers to the page & paragraph):- “Road PIP cost [8.6]: In each bound, the first move of each single element or column uses 0 PIPs if it is entirely by road, AND moves until it contacts enemy (and conforms) or friends or moves its full tactical move distance, and does not reverse direction. Each other (non road) tactical move uses 1 PIP.
Extra PIP costs [8.7]: Except in the side’s first bound, a move that uses a PIP uses up an extra PIP for each of the two following cases that apply:- (a) If the moving element or group includes any Scythed Chariots not moving into contact with enemy, OR ANY Elephants, Hordes, War Wagons, Artillery, denizens or camp followers, or is an element currently garrisoning a city, fort or camp. (b) If the moving element is not the general’s element and either its general’s element has been lost or is entirely:- in a BUA, camp, Wood, Oasis, Marsh or Gully or if the element or group to be moved starts more than (the) command distance from its general. Command distance is 20 BW if entirely Light Horse. Otherwise, it is 8 BW, but is reduced to 4 BW for troops entirely:- beyond the crest of any Hill, beyond a BUA or a camp, on a Difficult Hill, or in or beyond a Wood, Oasis or Dunes.”So what does it all mean? Well, the moves in the first bound always cost 1 PIP, no matter who they are or whether in command range or not. And in any bound, the first move down a road costs no PIP’s. That’s about it really. Some Helpful Downloads can be found here: fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Reference_sheets_and_epitomes And here is the latest Jan 2020 FAQ: ancientwargaming.files.wordpress.com/2020/01/dba_faq_q1_2020_final.pdf
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Post by brasidas19004 on Aug 23, 2022 12:28:48 GMT
Whew, thanks a lot! And I see that there already is a grid game in those helpful download locations. Thanks for your work! Alex
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Post by stevie on Aug 23, 2022 13:09:33 GMT
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Post by medievalthomas on Sept 13, 2022 17:22:19 GMT
One of the more obscure passages due to a playtester insisting on sticking in yet another clause to the sentence.
I've fixed it in the text of D3H2 to make clear as you and many others have mistaken its intent.
I can control the text in D3H2 and fix things but I can't get the Barker's to even approve typos so this must stand as written in DBA 3.0 but its not the intent to allow all first moves for 0 PIPs.
I have been working since finishing with DBA 3.0 and D3H2 on producing clear versions of the basic DBX mechanics and have just finished the 2nd edition of that project: A Game of Knights & Knaves.
TomT
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