cgd
Munifex
Posts: 21
|
Post by cgd on May 24, 2022 16:53:04 GMT
Hello guys,
I have (once again) an argument with goldenhord about rules. 
Pk supported by Pk are fighting a knight, so rear support applies.
Now, a new element (let's say a LH) enters the fight, flanking both Pk elements (the knight is still on the front of the first pike element).
My undestanding is that there is only one combat, where the second pike still supports the first one (ie +1), and the LH gives a malus (-1), the final factor of the pikes being 4 (ie 4 +1 -1) against 3 for the knight, and where if the pikes loose the combat, both of them are destroyed. goldenhord think that the rear pike no longer provides rear support.
Could you please help us ?
Thanks
|
|
|
|
Post by Baldie on May 24, 2022 17:26:53 GMT
Hi There
You are right I believe
Addition, sticking my neck out here
Even if LH only flanked the rear pike it would not turn to face. In this case I am not sure if -1 to combat and if just front one dies.
|
|
|
|
Post by goldenhord on May 24, 2022 17:52:56 GMT
Just for more detail, we agree there is only one combat and that the LH give a malus of -1 due to his flanking. The queston is only on the pike support which applies or not.
§10;7 said When an element is in close combat both to front and to flank or rear or in close combat to its front and overlapped; only it and the enemy in front fight each other.
Others only provide tactical factors.
Could explain this sentence according your understanding ?
|
|
|
|
Post by medievalthomas on May 24, 2022 18:26:26 GMT
The rear Pike still provides Rear Support against a front fighting element of a type that grants rear support (which Knights do).
TomT
|
|
|
|
Post by menacussecundus on May 24, 2022 19:57:39 GMT
Just for more detail, we agree there is only one combat and that the LH give a malus of -1 due to his flanking. The queston is only on the pike support which applies or not. §10;7 said When an element is in close combat both to front and to flank or rear or in close combat to its front and overlapped; only it and the enemy in front fight each other. Others only provide tactical factors. Could explain this sentence according your understanding ? You use the relevant combat factors for the two elements in front edge to front edge contact with each other. (In this instance, +4 for the Pk and +3 for the Kn.) The LH on the flank would normally have a combat factor of +2. However, it isn't the element doing the fighting. It only provides a tactical factor. (-1 to the Pk.) Similarly, the second rank of Pk provides a tactical factor (of +1). Does that make matters any clearer or have I simply added to the fog of war? |
|
|
|
Post by stevie on May 24, 2022 21:02:38 GMT
In this case I would simply go by the rules...
...assuming that the figure examples are part of the rules.
And Figure 20a gives a detailed explanation of this situation.
|
|
|
|
Post by goldenhord on May 25, 2022 19:53:37 GMT
we are always playing like that for many years but it doesn't explain the sentence. figure 20a does not mention the support but i do agree that suppress the support bring a double malus to the pike,warband,etc.
|
|
|
|
Post by stevie on May 26, 2022 3:08:25 GMT
Figure 20a does not mention the support... Oh yes it does.  Figure 20a dialogue, 4th sentence, quote:- “In both examples, Pike Y is providing rear support to Pike X.” It does not say the rear support is ‘cancelled’ if attacked in the flank. |
|
|
|
Post by goldenhord on May 26, 2022 9:08:21 GMT
you are right Stevie, figures better than wording as always.
|
|
