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Post by notintheface on Mar 7, 2020 5:04:09 GMT
Hello chaps, is there ever a reason why you wouldn’t want to double element your knights if that’s an option, I can’t see any downside but I am a knightophile.
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Post by paddy649 on Mar 7, 2020 6:21:22 GMT
6Kn are just as vulnerable to bow shooting as 3Kn and die just as easily - so the extra VP for the first killed really hurts. Plus the DBE +1 is only against foot so mounted kill them just as easily as 3Kn. Also the +1 doesn’t help much vs blades who are looking for a draw.
So if you are fighting a mainly foot army with few bow then using 6Kn has its advantages if you can put up with the fragility of being defeated after only losing 3 units.
But on the plus side a wedge of Teutonic Knights does look stunning!
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Post by chaotic on Mar 7, 2020 6:23:32 GMT
There are two reasons:
1. The first double element lost counts as 2 elements lost, or <gasp!> 3 if it is your General element.
2. Double elements - especially mounted - are clumsy and harder to manoeuvre than single elements.
Of course, these problems are balanced by their advantages, but I don't think you should treat double elements as an automatic inclusion.
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Post by Haardrada on Mar 7, 2020 7:40:53 GMT
Add to the above, manoeuvring. When lines crash together it can become a bit cramped for space to turn a double mounted element, so closing the door with one could be a rare opertunity unless space is available.. or if the Double mounted element is on an end of a line with room to turn.
Butthey truly do look nice.
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Post by notintheface on Mar 7, 2020 9:03:16 GMT
Interesting, after that sage advice I shall get enough figs to cover all options and not lock myself in. Just started to read the rules but nothing will be clear in my head till I have a game or 3, hope to get to league of ancients on the 15th or is that the13th? For a dba night.
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Post by notintheface on Mar 8, 2020 5:11:19 GMT
So if I was to dismount a double element would that mean two elements of
foot? That would take you over the 12 element limit would it not?
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Post by stevie on Mar 8, 2020 8:34:03 GMT
So if I was to dismount a double element would that mean two elements of foot? That would take you over the 12 element limit would it not? Well, to do that you’d first have to find a 6Kn or 6Cv element in the Army Lists that was allowed to dismount...and there isn’t one. Armies with 6Kn Armies with 6Cv
III/65 Nikephorian Byzantines II/61b Mu-jung Hsien-Pi
IIV/13 Medieval Germans III/4b Early Byzantines
IV/30 Teutonic Orders III/17 Maurikian Byzantines
IV/43c Later Hungarians III/27 Rshtuni Armeanians
IV/79c Later Swiss III/29 Thematic Byzantines
III/55 Early Samurai
IV/59 Post-Mongol Samurai
...none of whom have the dismount ability. (Likewise, there aren’t any Littoral WWg in any of the Army Lists...
...so prohibiting WWg from making an amphibious landing is pretty academic) |
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Post by sheffmark on Mar 8, 2020 8:47:57 GMT
So if I was to dismount a double element would that mean two elements of foot? That would take you over the 12 element limit would it not? Well, to do that you’d first have to find a 6Kn or 6Cv element in the Army Lists that was allowed to dismount...and there isn’t one. Armies with 6Kn Armies with 6Cv
III/65 Nikephorian Byzantines II/61b Mu-jung Hsien-Pi
IIV/13 Medieval Germans III/4b Early Byzantines
IV/30 Teutonic Orders III/17 Maurikian Byzantines
IV/43c Later Hungarians III/27 Rshtuni Armeanians
IV/79c Later Swiss III/29 Thematic Byzantines
III/55 Early Samurai
IV/59 Post-Mongol Samurai
...none of whom have the dismount ability. Did that take you approx 2hr 50 minutes to go through all the lists to work that out? Or do you, as I suspect, have some massive spreadsheet you simply searched on? |
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Post by stevie on Mar 8, 2020 9:00:19 GMT
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Post by Baldie on Mar 8, 2020 11:22:05 GMT
I eagerly anticipate an army list with cross check to favourite tipple. |
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Post by notintheface on Mar 8, 2020 22:58:53 GMT
I think I see now Stevie so IV62a says
3x men at arms (3kn/4bd)
Does that mean they can dismount, I only asked about the double element for the rules said mounted can dismount I was thinking I had to buy matching foot to cover options which was a depressing thought, but unless mentioned in the army list then it’s a no
Although I think you are wrong with littoral wwg if you can model little snorkels for the figures then it should be allowed.
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Post by macbeth on Mar 9, 2020 6:44:12 GMT
Also the +1 doesn’t help much vs blades who are looking for a draw. I beg to differ here Paddy
The +1 for the 6Kn means that against an element of Bd the chance of a draw drops from 1 in 6 (16.7%) where the KnvsBd interaction is on even factors to 5/36 (13.9%) where the Kn have a 1 factor advantage.
Of course there is the horrendous pain when the draw occurs and the 2 element loss is felt
BUT - I do agree on the other point
A wedge of Teutonic Knights looks stunning
Cheers
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Post by timurilank on Mar 9, 2020 6:45:25 GMT
I think I see now Stevie so IV62a says 3x men at arms (3kn/4bd) Does that mean they can dismount, I only asked about the double element for the rules said mounted can dismount I was thinking I had to buy matching foot to cover options which was a depressing thought, but unless mentioned in the army list then it’s a no Although I think you are wrong with littoral wwg if you can model little snorkels for the figures then it should be allowed. Page 31 titled Army Lists
“/” between two codes or prefix numbers direct that either one be used by all (not some of) those elements. If between a mounted and a foot type it directs that all (not some of) the mounted type can be replaced by the foot type before deployment.
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Post by martin on Mar 9, 2020 8:58:16 GMT
Two Edged Sword (-Brethren)....fun to use, but a big hole in the army when they vaporize.
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