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Post by j on Aug 13, 2019 22:31:56 GMT
Just watched a YouTube video where a Scythed Chariot was shot at by Art.
They said that the Combat Outcomes meant that, if the score was a Draw, the SCh would be Destroyed but if Art shooting scored more than the SCh it would only Flee (whereas if it had been in Close Combat or Doubled it would likewise have been Destroyed)
Can anyone explain why a draw = Destroyed but rolling more than is only a Flee?
Regards,
j
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Post by lkmjbc on Aug 14, 2019 0:05:09 GMT
Just watched a YouTube video where a Scythed Chariot was shot at by Art. They said that the Combat Outcomes meant that, if the score was a Draw, the SCh would be Destroyed but if Art shooting scored more than the SCh it would only Flee (whereas if it had been in Close Combat or Doubled it would likewise have been Destroyed) Can anyone explain why a draw = Destroyed but rolling more than is only a Flee? Regards, j It is just a combat result. While we can if we want assign a reason for result, the reality is that the dice rolls are just a convenient way to produce a random result. Joe Collins |
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Post by stevie on Aug 14, 2019 5:42:20 GMT
Joe is of course correct...justifications are really secondary; it’s the effect that matters. (Or in the case of the DBA two-dice combat system, the chances out of 36). But here is a justification if you need it:- A Scythed Chariot doesn’t represent just a single vehicle, but a squadron of a dozen or more. Likewise, Artillery represents a battery of a dozen plus machines, shooting maybe once a minute. If the first volley from the Art hits say a single SCh (and you only need to kill or serious wound one of the four horses to render the whole contraption useless), that’s not enough to panic the other drivers, so they press on. A minute later another is hit, and they press on, then a minute later another is hit, and they continue to press on...all this happening in a single 15 minute DBA bound. It’s only when they realise that about half of them have been rendered interoperable does their morale break, but by then it’s too late, as even when running away they are still being hit and knocked-out, and so many losses has made the SCh squadron unable to function as a unit so it’s counted as being ‘destroyed’. ...on the other hand... If the Artillery were more accurate with their first volley (i.e. rolled a better score), then three or four of the SCh would be knocked-out in that very first minute. That would panic the drivers (and the horses), and a cry of “sod this for a game of soldiers!” would result in the whole formation making a run for it... ...and they get away because by fleeing they have not penetrated too far and can outdistance the Artillery. After a quick flight they are halted, rallied and reformed by their officers, and are ready to try again. (Yes, I do have a very vivid imagination...  )Some Helpful Downloads can be found here: fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Reference_sheets_and_epitomes
And here is the latest Jan 2019 FAQ: fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/FAQ_2019_1st_Quarter
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Post by vtsaogames on Aug 14, 2019 11:33:46 GMT
I have seen game designers jump through hoops rationalizing their game mechanisms, but this is a MARATHON effort, Stevie! It deserves confetti and a pop of the cork.  |
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Post by stevie on Aug 14, 2019 15:04:53 GMT
That’s what makes DBA such a beautifully simple and quick-to-play simulation of ancient warfare. Other rulesets have long, time consuming, and unnecessarily complex ‘morale’ charts and checks. In DBA, morale is automatically covered by the combat outcomes. After all, pursuing, recoiling, fleeing, and being ‘destroyed’ (i.e routing) are all morale effects. (That’s why I coloured all the post-combat events in ‘cowardly yellow’ in those crib sheets of mine)Some Helpful Downloads can be found here: fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Reference_sheets_and_epitomes
And here is the latest Jan 2019 FAQ: fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/FAQ_2019_1st_Quarter
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Post by primuspilus on Aug 14, 2019 22:15:09 GMT
Echoing what Stevie said, it's a way of doing probability distributions without using odds columns and CRT's. What is the probability of a tie versus a "beat"?. We can always put DBA into a rows and columns CRT if you need a visual on the outcomes a priori, but I have it on good authority that most would hate that!
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Post by bob on Aug 15, 2019 1:46:54 GMT
Here is Phil's take on this, from the development time, when I asked about this.
" SCh charging Art is so rare, I don’t think it deserves much worrying about! I would play it as written, and try to rationalise what happened with a plausible story. Maybe the shooting was so fierce that the horses would not close?
Phil"
I reminded him that there were only 7 armies that have SCh and 3 of them are Seleucid Army.
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Post by j on Aug 15, 2019 11:46:12 GMT
Here is Phil's take on this, from the development time, when I asked about this. " SCh charging Art is so rare, I don’t think it deserves much worrying about! I would play it as written, and try to rationalise what happened with a plausible story. Maybe the shooting was so fierce that the horses would not close? Phil" I reminded him that there were only 7 armies that have SCh and 3 of them are Seleucid Army. I get that & if the answer to my question is "that's just how it is" I can deal with it. Btw the SCh weren't charging the Art (in that case, anything other than a win by the SCh results in their destruction, quite rightly) but were targeted by the Art in its own bound. It just seemed odd that, when shooting, a draw would have the same effect as doubling, destroying the target, while a beaten but not doubled would have a lesser effect, causing the target to Flee. Regards, j |
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