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Post by stevie on Mar 30, 2019 15:06:40 GMT
So Joe, when page 6 paragraph 3 says “The defender chooses and places 1-2 compulsory and 2-3 optional features”, it’s lying, and Arable can have three compulsory features. Can a Forest or Tropical region do the same, and have:- 2 Woods (1st compulsory choice) 1 Wood (2nd compulsory choice) 3 others (optional choices) And Dry regions have:- 2 Rocky features (1st compulsory choice) 2 Scrub features (2nd compulsory choice) 3 others (optional choices). If not, why not? Since when did “1 to 2” come to mean “1 to 3”...or even “1 to 4”? Some Helpful Downloads can be found here: fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Reference_sheets_and_epitomes
And here is the latest Jan 2019 FAQ: fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/FAQ_2019_1st_Quarter
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Post by paddy649 on Mar 30, 2019 16:17:21 GMT
First... You can take 2 compulsory features. You are limited however to only one bua. You are also limited to 3 plough. So...you may take 1 bua as your first compulsory. You can take 2 plough as your second. You may then take 1 extra plough. Cities, castles, villages, and monasteries were most often surrounded by ploughed fields. Also ..the hill modeled under a bua is decorative only. Joe Collins Joe - You really confuse me first with the difinition of two compulsory features equaling three. The rules say 1-2 compulsory features and don’t imply that plough count half. Then by defining a “larger hill” as decorative when that word or any similar is totally absent from the text - indeed the rules even talk about the hill needing a road if BG so units can get to the gate to assault it.......hardly decorative. I’m sure if the “larger hill” was decorative then PB would have stated that. |
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Post by lkmjbc on Mar 30, 2019 17:23:11 GMT
The 2 Plough is counted as one feature for this choice. Phil's wording is not the best here. He however was happy with it.
The hill is decorative only. The entire model counts as the BUA- hill included. Even if the city/castle/fort is but a small part of it. The road is decorative as well.
Joe Collins |
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Post by primuspilus on Mar 30, 2019 18:43:47 GMT
Stevie you need to redo your random terrain generator, mate...
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Post by bob on Mar 30, 2019 19:13:10 GMT
Is there anybody besides Joe wo thinks you can take a BUA AND two plough as your compulsory terrain?
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Post by lkmjbc on Mar 30, 2019 19:41:13 GMT
Is there anybody besides Joe wo thinks you can take a BUA AND two plough as your compulsory terrain? No one but Phil and me. Joe Collins |
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Post by primuspilus on Mar 30, 2019 19:45:34 GMT
In logic, "or" is typically taken as inclusive. I am guessing Phil is using the logical version of "or" and not the exclusive. Fine by me either way. I always thought that "1 BUA or 2 plough, but not both" was a very weird thing to do. As Joe says - frequently we see towns and villages surrounded by farmland. Especially since serious food transportation was all but impossible for anything other than grain...
Joe, I am thrilled to see this. Finally, the way Arable battlefields look are going to start making a LOT more sense!
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Post by primuspilus on Mar 30, 2019 19:54:27 GMT
So Joe, is this what Phil intended? Or is this what we should expect to see in an update to the FAQ?
For Arable: "Up to one BUA and/or up to 2 Plough?"
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Post by Simon on Mar 30, 2019 20:10:53 GMT
I think the rules as written (maybe not the same as intended - I can't mind read) are pretty clear. If arable, for compulsory, you must choose either one BUA or 2 (not 1) plough.
Simon
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Post by primuspilus on Mar 30, 2019 21:54:00 GMT
That isn't the point. There are army list errors that are just as clear. It appears that Phil did NOT intend to exclude BOTH BUA and Plough as choices in Arable - unless he meant "extra" Plough would allow you to place 1 BUA and up to three "extra" Plough, as in "extra to the compulsory requirements".
I prefer to hear directly from Joe on whether this is going to be clarified in the FAQs. It seems laughable to me that in Arable, a terrain type defined by its amenity to farming and agriculture, is prevented from having all but the occasional Plough if a BUA is chosen. Even in today's super built-up world, there are often extensive networks of "Plough" on the outskirts of most North American cities for instance.
Makes perfect sense to me that one can choose 1 BUA and one Plough (that's two compulsory features) in an Arable region! I find it unfathomable that the only built-up places where ancient through medieval battles took place in Arable regions, were those that happened to be all but devoid of Ploughed fields...
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Post by primuspilus on Mar 30, 2019 22:00:50 GMT
I think the rules as written (maybe not the same as intended - I can't mind read) are pretty clear. If arable, for compulsory, you must choose either one BUA or 2 (not 1) plough. Simon
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Post by goragrad on Mar 30, 2019 22:01:52 GMT
I just happened to see that bob posted a question on the Yahoo DBA group as to whether he could pick a BUA and 2 plow as his compulsory (notification of a response showed up in my email).
First response there was 'no.'
If that ends up as being the consensus, it really does fly against historical reality as as noted by primuspilus - towns and villages were usually surrounded by fields.
As written by choosing a BUA you are prohibited from having plowed fields on the battlefield. You only get plowed if there is no BUA...
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Post by primuspilus on Mar 30, 2019 22:22:17 GMT
I plan to ignore the consensus on this if it is "no".
The above picture clearly shows a hamlet and several plough, some of which most definitely would be mud if it rained! It seems ludicrous that DBA is a basically banning what looks to me like a pretty standard battlefield for the ancient world. Good enough for me and my games.
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Post by Les1964 on Mar 30, 2019 22:38:44 GMT
I plan to ignore the consensus on this if it is "no". The above picture clearly shows a hamlet and several plough, some of which most definitely would be mud if it rained! It seems ludicrous that DBA is a basically banning what looks to me like a pretty standard battlefield for the ancient world. Good enough for me and my games. In the end it comes down to 1 word , "and" or "or" , 1 lets you take all 3 pieces , and 1 doesn't .  |
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Post by pawsbill on Mar 30, 2019 22:53:16 GMT
First... You can take 2 compulsory features. You are limited however to only one bua. You are also limited to 3 plough. So...you may take 1 bua as your first compulsory. You can take 2 plough as your second. You may then take 1 extra plough. Claptrap!
2 Plough are Two features. 1 BUA plus 2 Plough would be Three compulsory features.
Your interpretation would allow anyone to choose (for example) 2 Rocky as their first compulsory for Dry, then 2 Scrub as their second compulsory choice for a total of Four compulsory features.
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