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Post by Antoine on Oct 19, 2017 1:07:05 GMT
Gentlemen,
I've got a silly question about shooting as I'll be fielding soon a shooting element for the first time in my DBA experience (Marian roman artillery).
I usually play armies that don't have bows/artillery :/
So here's the question:
when does a unit shoot, after all PiPs are spent or during the PiP phase ?
bonus question: when not facing ellies, is Art interesting ?
Thanks
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Post by felixs on Oct 19, 2017 5:50:19 GMT
Units shoot after all PIPs are spent (i. e. after the PIP phase) and before close combat.
I find Artillery interesting and fun. Whether it is effective depends on many factors, terrain featuring prominently among them.
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Post by constabledavid on Oct 19, 2017 6:49:03 GMT
On Monday I played with Early Imperial Roman verses Ancient British, in the second game it destroyed three out of the four elements killed, all warbands. Despite this I lost.
In the first game only the auxilia were involved, I won.
If you have either enough bow, or the correct targets it can work. For instance, if you have an artillery piece on one flank, you might scare an opponent into deploying their elephants on the other flank, where you want them to go.
David Constable
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Post by phippsy on Oct 19, 2017 7:29:55 GMT
Hi Antoine,
Again having a plan for fields of fire is important, often associated with channelling of enemy forces between terrain features can assist in effectiveness.
Peter
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Post by timurilank on Oct 19, 2017 7:47:03 GMT
Gentlemen, I've got a silly question about shooting as I'll be fielding soon a shooting element for the first time in my DBA experience (Marian roman artillery). I usually play armies that don't have bows/artillery :/ So here's the question: when does a unit shoot, after all PiPs are spent or during the PiP phase ? bonus question: when not facing ellies, is Art interesting ? Thanks Antoine,
Much will depend on your style of play.
The downside:
If you are an aggressive player you may be covering likely targets as your army moves quickly forward.
Artillery requires an extra pip to move, even to rotate in place.
Unless you are a ‘bold’ player, they cannot be left alone so keeping an element in support is wise.
The upside:
With a shooting range of 5BW, artillery has a tendency to intimidate a number of troop types, especially elephants, scythed chariots, war wagons and enemy artillery.
Classed as ‘foot’ they may garrison a city or fort and if the BUA is positioned in your opponent’s deployment zone, have your camera ready to take a photo of your opponent’s face.
Artillery can shoot through or over enemy psiloi (Distant Shooting, paragraph 3, last sentence).
I have only three artillery in my collection of 90 plus armies and all are for the Middle Imperial Roman.
They did perform well to clear difficult hills of enemy archers and breaking up groups of barbarians. Also useful to cover river crossing.
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Post by medievalthomas on Oct 19, 2017 16:17:55 GMT
Move spending PIPs
Shooting
Close Combat
Art devestating to Bow beyond 3BW. Bear in mind when using Bow/Art combos you use the closest Shooter's CF (often the Bow's). Also if deployed in BUA it cuts factor to +2 (but gains all round Shooting).
TomT
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Post by bob on Oct 19, 2017 19:12:23 GMT
Crucial rule about shooting that new users sometimes forget.
Artillery shoots only in your bound (if you did not move it) but Bows and Warwagons shoot in every bound unless they have moved more than 1 Base Width. So always in enemy bound.
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Post by Antoine on Oct 19, 2017 22:01:48 GMT
Thanks for all the replies/advices  |
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Post by Simon on Oct 20, 2017 7:13:20 GMT
Crucial rule about shooting that new users sometimes forget. Artillery shoots only in your bound (if you did not move it) but Bows and Warwagons shoot in every bound unless they have moved more than 1 Base Width. So always in enemy bound. Although a rare occurrence, artillery are allowed to shoot in the opponent's bound if shooting back at artillery shooting at them. Artillery are also excused the priorities for shooting that bows and WWg are subject to. Regards, Simon |
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Post by medievalthomas on Oct 25, 2017 17:06:48 GMT
Please note that my contention that you use the factors of the closest shooter has been lampooned on another forum. So please note that not all agree this is correct. It is how I intend to rule in tournaments I run and write up in any supplemental material. But it is not universally accepted. So please bear in mind that all my comments mean: this is my best effort to discern what the particular language means and how I intend to rule and write up the rule. Not that I know to any absolute certainty what a particular phrase in the rules actually means.
TomT
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Post by Simon on Oct 25, 2017 17:23:12 GMT
Please note that my contention that you use the factors of the closest shooter has been lampooned on another forum. So please note that not all agree this is correct. It is how I intend to rule in tournaments I run and write up in any supplemental material. But it is not universally accepted. So please bear in mind that all my comments mean: this is my best effort to discern what the particular language means and how I intend to rule and write up the rule. Not that I know to any absolute certainty what a particular phrase in the rules actually means. TomT Tom, I am a bit surprised that there is any debate on this point. I believe you are right and the 4th paragraph under Shooting on P10 clearly refers to 2nd or 3rd shooters aiding the shooting of the nearest. Regards Simon |
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Post by stevie on Oct 25, 2017 19:00:32 GMT
I agree entirely with Simon (although I think the relevant section is on page 10 paragraph 5). Tom, ask those that dare to mock you how they interpret the following:- “A second or third element shooting at the same target aids the shooting of the nearest by providing it with a tactical factor instead of being resolved separately.” Seems pretty clear to me. Some potentially useful player aids can be found here, including the latest June 2017 FAQ and the Quick Reference Sheets from the Society of Ancients:-
fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Reference_sheets_and_epitomes
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Post by Simon on Oct 25, 2017 21:07:21 GMT
We do agree Stevie - my reference was to the 4th paragraph of the Shooting section on page 10, which is the same as the 5th paragraph overall on that page! Same reference point. Cheers simon |
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Post by bob on Oct 25, 2017 21:42:51 GMT
To add support, I fully agree that when more than one shooter targets the same element, the factor of the shooter closest to the target is the factor used, and the other(s) provide a minus one factor. The rule In DBA 3 seems to be exactly the same as it was in the original DBA and has been play that way since the beginning.
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Post by stevie on Oct 26, 2017 9:14:10 GMT
I agree entirely with Simon (although I think the relevant section is on page 10 paragraph 5).
We do agree Stevie - my reference was to the 4th paragraph of the Shooting section on page 10, which is the same as the 5th paragraph overall on that page! Same reference point. Cheers simon Oops, sorry Simon, I misunderstood what you wrote...yet again!  You know, if each paragraph in the rules had its own number, like other rule systems do, things would be much clearer. ( Another thing for medievalthomas's "Knights and Knaves" and Joe Collins "DBA 3.1" perhaps...)  Some potentially useful player aids can be found here, including the latest June 2017 FAQ and the Quick Reference Sheets from the Society of Ancients:-
fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Reference_sheets_and_epitomes
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