|
|
Post by megoose on Aug 4, 2022 7:20:37 GMT
I was reading my 3.0 rules.....was in the shooting section..and looked at the figures showing outcomes.
If shot entirely from the rear, and you recoil...do you die?
|
|
|
|
Post by martin on Aug 4, 2022 7:29:43 GMT
I was reading my 3.0 rules.....was in the shooting section..and looked at the figures showing outcomes. If shot entirely from the rear, and you recoil...do you die? Not in 3.0*. Any recoil from shooting even partly at the rear requires 180 degree turn and recoil. *However, if the target is a second rank element, and after turning cannot recoil, then it is destroyed. Significant change from 2.2. |
|
|
|
Post by menacussecundus on Aug 4, 2022 7:32:05 GMT
Not automatically.
If, after turning, the element which has been shot at has its rear edge in contact with an element it cannot interpenetrate or push back, then it would be destroyed. Otherwise it simply recoils.
Edit: Crossed with Martin's reply.
|
|
|
|
Post by stevie on Aug 4, 2022 7:58:27 GMT
Just reinforcing both Martin’s and Menacussescundus’ comments. This situation is covered in the rules on page 12, second paragraph, third sentence:- “An element with a recoil outcome as a result of shooting which was at least partially at its rear edge turns to face its rear before recoiling.” But also note the following from the latest Jan 2020 FAQ:- Q: I have a Light Horse element that was shot by artillery in the rear who was the primary shooter. The Combat Outcome states that it will flee to its rear. This will actually have it contact the artillery that shot it. Is this correct? A: This is the result for the rules as written but is an oversight in the rules. With both players’ agreement, use this exception... "An element with a Flee outcome to shooting at least partially on its rear edge, does not turn 180° before moving but just Flees straight forward." This would apply to any element receiving a flee result from shooting at least partially to its rear edge. We recommend adding this exception as the last line of the first paragraph regarding "Fleeing" on page 12. Some Helpful Downloads can be found here: fanaticus-dba.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Reference_sheets_and_epitomes
And here is the latest Jan 2020 FAQ: ancientwargaming.files.wordpress.com/2020/01/dba_faq_q1_2020_final.pdf |
|
|
|
Post by megoose on Aug 4, 2022 12:03:50 GMT
Thx guys. I found the rule, on page 12....
It IS a big change from 2.2
3.0 has some interesting rules...if the solid Bow... has a solid Bd on either side...does it get +1 just once...or +1 for each.
I like 8Bw....they look cool....and they stood up well vs Feudal English in 2 DBM battles I used them in.
In DBA 3.0...i like the +1 for the 8Bw
|
|
|
|
Post by menacussecundus on Aug 4, 2022 12:27:52 GMT
......... 3.0 has some interesting rules...if the solid Bow... has a solid Bd on either side...does it get +1 just once...or +1 for each. ........ Just the once. "at least one flank edge in contact" gets the +1, but both doesn't get any more. |
|
|
|
Post by megoose on Aug 5, 2022 11:21:39 GMT
Thx.
I was actually shocked to see the rear support.....Ps support for Bd, Sp, Ax gone
David K. will have to update/redo his great paper...the analysis he did of the different armies
|
|
|
|
Post by menacussecundus on Aug 5, 2022 12:06:25 GMT
Thx. I was actually shocked to see the rear support.....Ps support for Bd, Sp, Ax gone David K. will have to update/redo his great paper...the analysis he did of the different armies David K went off and wrote his own set of rules. Part of the great v3 Schism. |
|
|
|
Post by megoose on Aug 9, 2022 6:23:36 GMT
Really? Cool....
How playable were his rules? I imagine they were pretty good.
With all the different interpretations of OLD texts that WRG has done...it's frustrating.
DBM...might have 8Bw for an army..but BBA2.2 no...DBMM says yes...then DBA3 says no
Example
In another thread, i wrote about the destruction of my armies. I'm looking at the remnants...and seeing what i can cobble together for 3.0 in the short term
So...I was looking at Warring States....
Differnt WRG sets have the foot as different types...possible 8bw....another Pk...another Ax
In DBA3......NO 8Bw option.....but read the written description about the infantry...
long halbards (or spears) WITH archers shooting from BEHIND
"Archers shooting from behind"....isnt that A) Ps rear support...or B) 8Bw
No Ps rear support in 3.0...and the army has no 8Bw troops in 3.0
...so..how to do the shooting from behind the spear/halberds in 3.0.....
I can name other armies with the same 8Bw nonsense....like my Han Chinese...DBM vs DBA 2.2.
I've used my Han DBM in Australia...with 8Bw....(and as an 8Bw army vs Feudal English...they were TOUGH)..and then had to use in 2.2 ...a few hours later...with Bw elements and Sp elements
The same company, reading the SAME original docs.....reinterpreting every time they decide to nake a new rules set
|
|
|
|
Post by medievalthomas on Aug 10, 2022 19:56:58 GMT
Welcome to 3.0.
Ps support caused lots of historical problems and vastly overstated the power of such light troops. It turned them into 81mm mortar stands instead of skirmishers. So those troop types that had real bow support got it rolled into their CF.
You only get Shieldwall (Side Support for Spear from either Blade/Spear) +1 once - even if double supported. Same for Retinue (side support for Bow from Blade).
The troop type categories have always been he DBX bugaboo. Trying to smash different troop capabilities into set troop types is near impossible. But we did our best and Phil has never been consistent in this area in any case. In DBA 3.0 we went more heavily for historical effect than tournament winner so some armies changed.
But we are always advancing the DBX art. So experiment with allowing Bow to give a +1 Rear Support modifier to Close Order Foot. Also try this for Halberds: +4 CF, Drive Off Mounted (Recoil on Equals), Retinue, Pursue Foot except Ps and Lethal (+1 on a winning score). This should make them preform much closer to their historical prototypes.
And please relay any concerns about how armies are preforming v. historical performance as this remains the main interest of our development team.
Thomas J. Thomas
Fame & Glory Games
|
|
|
|
Post by medievalthomas on Aug 10, 2022 20:00:34 GMT
Oh sorry - your original question - shooting from behind. The target turns 180 degrees (faces backwards) and then Recoils. It is not Destoryed if it can at least start its Recoil. Note there is a typo re Fleeing. An Element with a Fleeing result when shot on the Rear turns only once and then Flees. (It does not turn for being shot on the Rear then turn again for Fleeing).
TomT
|
|
|
|
Post by megoose on Aug 11, 2022 4:10:01 GMT
Thx
|
|
