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Post by goragrad on May 10, 2020 11:19:37 GMT
Got some of these figures (MID93) - cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0157/3412/products/gal_mid93_large.jpgas part of an army lot. I have yet to find a reference that shows a round shield of that size. Essex has them as CV and KN in their Early Polish and CV in the 'b' Feudal Spanish. Aside from having that shield they are armored cap a pie and would seem to be KN. Before I use them I would at least like to know if there is any historical source for that shield, although I am painting up some of the MID79b figure that have a similar shield for my caballeros villanos. cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0157/3412/products/gal_mid79a_large.jpgIf anyone can shed some light on this it would be appreciated.
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Post by timurilank on May 10, 2020 15:19:03 GMT
Got some of these figures (MID93) - cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0157/3412/products/gal_mid93_large.jpgas part of an army lot. I have yet to find a reference that shows a round shield of that size. Essex has them as CV and KN in their Early Polish and CV in the 'b' Feudal Spanish. Aside from having that shield they are armored cap a pie and would seem to be KN. Before I use them I would at least like to know if there is any historical source for that shield, although I am painting up some of the MID79b figure that have a similar shield for my caballeros villanos. cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0157/3412/products/gal_mid79a_large.jpgIf anyone can shed some light on this it would be appreciated. Looking at the illustrations of Spanish knights in Ian Heath’s book, Armies of Feudal Europe, shields are circular up to the 11th and 12th century and are a lighter type, flat and have tassel decoration. Illustrations from the ‘ Cantigas’ manuscript is helpful for clothing colour, banners, and bardings. duckduckgo.com/?q=illustrations+cantigas+manuscripts&t=h_&ia=images&iax=images
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Post by Les1964 on May 10, 2020 17:01:28 GMT
Looking at the illustrations of Spanish knights in Ian Heath’s book, Armies of Feudal Europe, shields are circular up to the 11th and 12th century and are a lighter type, flat and have tassel decoration. Essex MID80 Spanish: Knights, 1150-1300AD with Lance & Round Shield on Barded Horse
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Post by Haardrada on May 10, 2020 19:15:22 GMT
My curiosity was roused by this topic to look further into the subject. Although slightly earlier than my beloved Grenadines, the armour and shields of the era are of interest to me.
As shown in previous posts the horse tail shields were in use and are based on an Andalusian/Muslim influence.However,large round shields were still in use through the 10th-11th centuries and an example is supposedly depicted on the tomb of King James I of Aragon but decreased in use by the end of the period. So using the figures are depicting Knights within that timescale. 🙂
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Post by Les1964 on May 11, 2020 21:50:48 GMT
While people are talking about Feudal Spanish , would these be ok for the whole period covered by III/35 b&c? If not which Essex code is best for the the period of the later c list ?
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Post by Haardrada on May 11, 2020 22:43:03 GMT
According to the description of the figure in Ian Heath's Armies of Feudal Europe these figures would be fine in an army up to 1285AD.After that Assises were introduced to standardise arms and armour.Figures from Esses MID 41-45 could be used to replace them.
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Post by Haardrada on May 12, 2020 11:36:18 GMT
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Post by Les1964 on May 12, 2020 21:19:48 GMT
The skingers have large shield , most i've seen have smaller shields .
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Post by paulisper on May 12, 2020 21:29:50 GMT
The skingers have large shield , most i've seen have smaller shields . Probably some poetic licence here on my behalf - they’re from the Mirliton crusader range, so about the right timeline, but maybe the wrong part of the Med. Who knows, there were plenty of comings and goings into the Iberian peninsula at this time... 😉 P
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Post by Haardrada on May 12, 2020 22:25:22 GMT
The skingers have large shield , most i've seen have smaller shields . Probably some poetic licence here on my behalf - they’re from the Mirliton crusader range, so about the right timeline, but maybe the wrong part of the Med. Who knows, there were plenty of comings and goings into the Iberian peninsula at this time... 😉 P These coming and goings could be possible, Guzz Cavalry were present in Spain serving in Berber armies. 😁
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Post by goragrad on May 13, 2020 6:01:03 GMT
Appreciate the responses.
I do have knights with the tasseled rounds (which Heath noted continued in use thru the 13th Century).
In further looking at Heath, I note that I need to mix in a fair proportion of kite shields as well.
By the way, Haardrada, in the online excerpt from Heath the date for the assizes as 1385 not 1285, so for infantry I use the spearmen with the tassels for the 'c' as well a the 'b' list.
Presumably the Hermanidad militia come into play thereafter.
Nice work on those Spanish paul, I am using the Essex Later Spanish slingers and javelinmen myself.
One of the other questions now is what those MID93a shields were painted - the tasseled versions I see illustrated are white, red, and a green.
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Post by Haardrada on May 13, 2020 7:23:45 GMT
By the way, Haardrada, in the online excerpt from Heath the date for the assizes as 1385 not 1285, so for infantry I use the spearmen with the tassels for the 'c' as well a the 'b' list. Presumably the Hermanidad militia come into play. My mistake, well spotted.🙂
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Post by Les1964 on May 13, 2020 13:30:23 GMT
This is the Cv element I got with a painted DBA Spanish from ebay . They are Essex figures , I don't know the code though .
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Post by Haardrada on May 13, 2020 14:47:46 GMT
This is the Cv element I got with a painted DBA Spanish from ebay . They are Essex figures , I don't know the code though . MID79 from the Feudal & Early Medieval range. 🙂
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Post by goragrad on May 14, 2020 10:24:45 GMT
Not to be picky, haardrada, but the code is MID79.
I just finished painting my MID79a element and gluing them to bases.
I will say that based on the illuminations showing a significant number of knights with kite shields my next caballeros villanos may be from the MID18s or 19s.
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