Question and wishes for D3H2

decebalus
Beneficiarii

Posts: 57

Question and wishes for D3H2 Sept 30, 2019 17:39:41 GMT eg407 likes this

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Post by decebalus on Sept 30, 2019 17:39:41 GMT

We played a 12 player HOTT campaign in 28mm using D3H2 last weekend. Many wonderful armies mostly from old warhammer models. I appreciate the work, making HOTT playable with the DBA3 rules.

But there were some problems and some questions, so here is a list. I hope it is some help for making D3H2 better.

First my wishes:

- PLEASE include a version number in your file. I was really pissed, that i painted an army for this event and noticed at the event, that all other players had a different point list. And we had no possibility to see, what is the actual version. So i had to change my army, because my list, was build with a 1 pt. cheaper Behemoth.

- I didnt analyse the shooting rules, but was told, they are different from DBA 3. IMO D3H2 should only give players of DBA3 the opportunity to play HOTT, not change the core rules. (Not even to make them better.)

- I think having the fast/solid option in a point based rule system leads to min-maxing. Why have solid blades or warbands, when the fast version is so much better. But ok., it is also in DBA 3. But having the same category for mounted IMO is a wrong move. Especially fast cavalry who have a higher basic move than LH feels weird.

The inconsistencies:

- Two different versions: Behemoth with 3 or 4 pts. What is right?

- Behemoth p. 12: Flee from artillery shooting. The overwiew: Artillery kills Behemoth.

- Beasts: p. 10: +3/+4. Overwiew: +4/+3.

The questions:

How does the TZ of aerials work:

- Can an aerial TZ a non-aerial element?

- Can a non-aerial element TZ a flying element? If yes, what can the non-aerial do, because he cant attack the aerial. Can he pass under the aerial?

- Can an aerial element TZ an aerial element?

- Sneakers: Do they irgnore TZs? Or can they only pass trough the TZing element?

- Gods. How are they handled regarding lost APs? i.e. p. 14 only lists "recoiled, fled and been pushed back across the battlefield edge", but not "leave". IMO are gods to weak, if they give the enemy automatic 4APs, but it should be explicitely stated.

Many thanks Frank

medievalthomas
Tribune

Posts: 879

Question and wishes for D3H2 Sept 30, 2019 21:43:01 GMT

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Post by medievalthomas on Sept 30, 2019 21:43:01 GMT

Sept 30, 2019 17:39:41 GMT decebalus said:

We played a 12 player HOTT campaign in 28mm using D3H2 last weekend. Many wonderful armies mostly from old warhammer models. I appreciate the work, making HOTT playable with the DBA3 rules.

But there were some problems and some questions, so here is a list. I hope it is some help for making D3H2 better.

First my wishes:

- PLEASE include a version number in your file. I was really pissed, that i painted an army for this event and noticed at the event, that all other players had a different point list. And we had no possibility to see, what is the actual version. So i had to change my army, because my list, was build with a 1 pt. cheaper Behemoth.

OK will create a version number - very good idea.

- I didnt analyse the shooting rules, but was told, they are different from DBA 3. IMO D3H2 should only give players of DBA3 the opportunity to play HOTT, not change the core rules. (Not even to make them better.)

The shooting rules are not different from DBA 3.0 - but it depends on your interpretation of DBA 3.0 rules - some believe that you can ignore elements that can shoot at you as a priority - but I don't.

- I think having the fast/solid option in a point based rule system leads to min-maxing. Why have solid blades or warbands, when the fast version is so much better. But ok., it is also in DBA 3. But having the same category for mounted IMO is a wrong move. Especially fast cavalry who have a higher basic move than LH feels weird.

Not all agree that the Fast version is better - as it Recoils on ties so does not hold up well in combat. Fast for all elements is extremely important for both historical battles and fantasy. You need Fast Knights for instance. Fast Cav represents a hybrid type - very mobile but hard hitting in the right circumstances but without staying power. Think Mongols or Dothraki. (Also covers Riders from traditional HOTT). Most LH should be Fast (esp. any w/bow) so would have equal speed (Cav & LH have equal speed in DBA also keep in mind that LH can make subsequent moves so even standard LH will tend to move more (hence effectively faster) than Fast Cav.

The inconsistencies:

- Two different versions: Behemoth with 3 or 4 pts. What is right?

I think Behemoth got set to 4pts due to play testing but I'll check.

- Behemoth p. 12: Flee from artillery shooting. The overwiew: Artillery kills Behemoth.

Sounds like a I screwed up with QR - I'll check and fix.

- Beasts: p. 10: +3/+4. Overwiew: +4/+3.

Beasts are +4 v. Mounted; +3 v. Foot.

The questions:

How does the TZ of aerials work:

- Can an aerial TZ a non-aerial element?
Yes

- Can a non-aerial element TZ a flying element? If yes, what can the non-aerial do, because he cant attack the aerial. Can he pass under the aerial?

Yes a "ground" element can TZ an aerial but an aerial can fly straight over a ground element thus leaving the TZ.

- Can an aerial element TZ an aerial element?

Yes

- Sneakers: Do they irgnore TZs? Or can they only pass trough the TZing element?

They don't ignore but can much like Flyers past straight through a TZing element and hence leave the TZ.

- Gods. How are they handled regarding lost APs? i.e. p. 14 only lists "recoiled, fled and been pushed back across the battlefield edge", but not "leave". IMO are gods to weak, if they give the enemy automatic 4APs, but it should be explicitely stated.

They are Lost when they leave and so count against lost AP. Neither the God or Dragon rules work well in HOTT but I'm stuck with them for D3H2. I've fixed Dragons in Knights & Knaves.

TomT

Many thanks Frank

decebalus Beneficiarii Posts: 57	Question and wishes for D3H2 Oct 1, 2019 12:49:47 GMT Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by decebalus on Oct 1, 2019 12:49:47 GMT Thanks for your answer. If you have a corrected version, it would be nice to send me a file. x5mofr at gmx dot de

medievalthomas Tribune Posts: 879	Question and wishes for D3H2 Oct 3, 2019 20:33:54 GMT Quote Select Post Deselect Post Link to Post Member Give Gift Back to Top Post by medievalthomas on Oct 3, 2019 20:33:54 GMT I'm going to update when I get the chance - number this version 1.1 so we don't have the same difficulties in the future. Thank you very much for the helpful feedback. Thomas J. Thomas Fame & Glory Games

Post by decebalus on Sept 30, 2019 17:39:41 GMT

Post by medievalthomas on Sept 30, 2019 21:43:01 GMT

Post by decebalus on Oct 1, 2019 12:49:47 GMT

Post by medievalthomas on Oct 3, 2019 20:33:54 GMT