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Post by jim1973 on Dec 16, 2023 13:07:27 GMT
Has to be bu middnight tonight to receive the next issue of SLingshot - though I'm enjoying ordering the back issues at the moment. Done. Thanks!
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Post by jim1973 on Dec 16, 2023 7:58:02 GMT
I'll have to renew my membership!
Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Dec 16, 2023 2:01:43 GMT
Perhaps the book 'The Macedonian Phalanx - Equipment, Organization & Tactics from Philip & Alexander to the Roman Conquest' by Richard Taylor might shed some light. (Only mentioning it because I just received an ad from Naval & Military Press about it.) Cheers. Thanks for this! I see the author has a book on the Greek Phalalnx as well. I find it very useful when authors have studied multiple topics so they are well informed to compare and contrast. Have to add these to to Santa's list! Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Dec 16, 2023 1:59:45 GMT
Oh, giving somebody a long stick and tell him to hold it in two hands pointing forward and walking towards something is quite differt then fencing with a shield and spear. Even linnen armour was quite expencive it seems. Philips Macedonians only had Pilos, small shield and graves for the front rank. Cheers B Giving someone a long spear and saying hide behind your big shield and just poke over the top can't be that hard as they were only part time soldiers after all. Front rankers probably had armour and those in the rear didn't, which is pretty much the same for hoplites.
I think reservists is a better description for hoplites, particularly from the Peloponnesian War and onwards . Large cities, like Athens, had compulsory service for their youth before they graduated to join the phalalnx (epheboi and peripoloi). Smaller cities may have kept to more traditional methods such as the Pyrrhike dances. The rise of mercenaries and war as a profession would add to the cadre of veterans needed to provide some instruction. Iphicratian-styled mercenaries may have been used by Phillip to start the transformation of his army. And of course, we have the Spartans. Cheers Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Dec 13, 2023 23:57:10 GMT
Hi, is there any evindence that pike were actually better then spear? I can't recall an incident where a pike unit beat a Hoplite unit on its OWN. I use HOTT a lot and also for Hellenistic battles, pike are just spear and that works fine. Using DBA you could even make Silvershields/Hypaspists a double spear element a la Thebans. Cheers B Certainly Bardunias and Ray agree with you ( Hoplites at War ). They are not the main stream. But they do make very good points though, that are worth discussing. I also agree with you regarding the economics of equipping a pikeman as opposed to a hoplite may have helped them flourish. I also think it may have been easier to train the men (two-handed pike v shield and spear). This would be help explain how Phillip managed to get a heavy infantry army in a relatively short period of time without a history of hoplites. Finally, I think 16 deep may have been a solution to provide staying power, particulalry for a new model army with a good population. But they are just opinions! Cheers Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Dec 10, 2023 5:53:18 GMT
Gentleman Whichever way you play it, the truth is simply "frontage, frontage, frontage". Pike need to be double based, then work your points value and factors accordingly. David Constable Still not convinced Pikes need to be double based in DBA. It seems that 16 deep was common enough in the Hellenistic period to be considered the norm. The Romans, as we all know, deployed in 3 lines and when each line deployed into battleline it would be about 6-8 men deep. So two lines are 12-16 deep plus space in between. In DBA we have the Hastati and Pricipes mixed together so a line of 8 elements of Polybian Roman blades should be about the same depth as Hellenistic pikes. Now there is no reason that the Romans couldn't march the Principes around the flank of the phalanx but we just don't seem to read that in the reports that have survived, certainly not routinely. On another note, what is a single element of Pikes supposed to represent in DBA3? I just don't see a historical example of thinned pikes. Alexander rearmed his phalangites for rough terrain but surely they would act more as medium infantry (dare I say the dreaded 4Ax?) than pikes? But just my 2c worth of opinion. Cheers Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Dec 5, 2023 21:54:59 GMT
For an even better display, I just saw the sneak peek of Little Wars TV Leipzig campaign on Youtube. The strategic map is impressive! Leipzig 1813Cheers Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Dec 5, 2023 2:21:58 GMT
Very nice, what size hexes do you use for the board? 55mm between parallel edges (about 63mm from corner to corner). Ordered from Back-2-Basix in South Australia. Jim PS I couldn't think of a nice way to mark the boundaries. Thought about roads/paths but couldn't make it look good
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Post by jim1973 on Nov 27, 2023 4:02:21 GMT
The problem of frontage can be fixed by double bases, but other problems will need factors sorting. It seems to me that the rules are going to change so much they will no longer be DBA. Always remember "a camel is a horse designed by a committee". David Constable Hi David. I don't think DBA3 itself is going to change. At least not for a long time. DBF will have its own ideas. Players will use their own house rules. But in the end, the common language will be the purple book (and what a tough language it is! đ). Cheers Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Nov 26, 2023 8:20:24 GMT
I've never been called honourable. And gentleman? I'm Australian! But I'll take it. Maybe early Swiss as 6Bd for their mobility and later Swiss mercenaries as 8Bd?
As for Hoplites v Pikes, I suspect you're right. It was the presence of Phillip and Alexander that made the difference. Even legionaries had to fight it out against phalanx formations, as the prototypes found out against Pyrrhus. Flexibility and tactical ability count for a lot. That's good for gamers!
Cheers
Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Nov 26, 2023 1:49:42 GMT
Medieval battles featuring the Swiss are also better, though I argue in other places that we will never be able (and shouldn't be able) to accurately model the Swiss without a quality grading factor. I can never understand the Swiss pike formations. Extremely dense columns with Halberdiers and Swordsmen thrown in. Didn't dominate cavalry despite having polearms. Very bloody engagements against the Landsknechts. Would they be better as double ranked Blades in DBA? Pikes in front and sides. Halberdiers in the two central rear positions. Cheers Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Nov 26, 2023 1:37:02 GMT
Exact battle sites are difficult to pinpoint. But the 254 bodies found under the Lion of Chaeronea monument are most likely the Sacred Band, which puts the battle close by. Google maps gives a great view of the topography. The river comes right up to the spur of Mt Akontio, a great terrain anchor and it would be easy to form a hoplite line of 30000, 8 shields deep, to cover the 4km to the foothills of the range south of Chaeronea. As defenders, they get to choose the battlefield so why not stretch Phillip's line? But we know that the lines were roughly equal and fought hard over a long period. If Phillip's entire army was 16 deep, this wouldn't work. We are missing something. I think Ray is onto something in Battles of 4th Century Greece, where he adds Greek allies to Phillip's army, increasing the heavy infantry. Phillip was as great a diplomat as a general and it is so common in Greek history for hoplites to be on both sides of the battle. But we'll never truly know so everyone's opinion is valid.
Cheers
Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Nov 25, 2023 12:41:31 GMT
Chaeronea for example plays much differently (Tease/Hint... you may just see this scenario one day). Pydna does as well. Very interested to see if it's Phillip's feigned flight and counterattack to defeat the Athenians or Alexander turning the Theban flank with a cavalry charge that wins the day in your scenario. Maybe you've even goth the Hypaspists as somewhat more useful than 4Ax! Cheers Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Nov 23, 2023 11:32:25 GMT
I've been quiet for a while as I was working on this project. My boardgame collection includes various Commands and Colors, which I intend to use as a gateway to get my boy into playing. I didn't like the Ancients board so I made my own modular board out of hex bases and with 3D terrain. But why stop at Ancients? The board will cover all the games so far. I'll just have to add more terrain for other periods as I play them. Hope you enjoy! Jim
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Post by jim1973 on Oct 29, 2023 10:51:35 GMT
With all this discussion about presentation of rule sets I thought this was interesting: youtu.be/b3F7EOgtDbM?si=vVJdMSnBiOfx4RzNI have no connection at all with this team but coming from the US I thought that it gives a broad perspective. Also with a Warhammer background I was expecting the authors to be a bit biased. However, I was pleasantly surprised that: DBA - the oldest set of rules being reviewed was viewed very positively. There were no negative comments about the writing of DBA. Substance was preferred to style - it wasnât all about presentation! The more âboutiqueâ games were called out for what they are. ADLG was trashed as being only good for competitions. However, I note that Triumph was lumped in with the DBA rulesets. What does anyone else make of this? Anyone tried the other two recommended rulesets: Age of Hannibal and To the Strongest? Age of Hannibal is from Greg Wagman of Little Wars TV. You can see them in use in their Pyrrhic Wars campaign linkThey are based on Chipco's Fantasy Rules!, which borrowed and adapted some DBx ideas. Cheers Jim
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